Basically like being at work lol. Would need to learn Rust first, though. I heard it’s complicated, but not sure what that means.

With the clearing deleted messages after 30 days, I take it that would also delete the username visability after 30 days too, or would it still leave the username of the deleted comment even after 30 days?

Interesting… lol didn’t know that. I feel like it should be configurable per instance

If a commit is brought in via PRs, they will be listed as contributors. It is at 153 contributors with 2 main ones. Not too shabby.

Sounds like a cool project!

Make sure to check the issues/PRs, it looks like people already worked on CTRL+Enter.

I agree with you on driveby PRs don’t help much at all. And I’m not going to pretend I’m going to sink the time required to understand how lemmy works and give quality PRs, and I don’t expect you to either. I just wanted to say, don’t let the language be what stops you.

I didn’t read the referenced/linked post, but you can check out the UI sources at github.com/LemmyNet/lemmy-ui.

It’s typescript - so a “heavy JS environment”. You’ll need nodeJS or another JS compiler.

That’s great to know! I’m contributing to the project but spent a whole night after work trying to find a working combination of branches for the ui and server. Their contributing docs for local development are poor. Which I should probably do something about besides complain… lol

Thanks, I joined Matrix server.

What is matrix?

Going front-to-back

The entirety of your first paragraph is a humongous red flag. Your rationale makes sense, and it appears at each stage of the process you made logical decisions but the end result is disaster. You are evidently a knowledgeable and intelligent person, so I’ll ask you now to consider how old the underlying technologies on the web are, and how the web looked when they were written. Web frameworks exist to bridge the gap between languages and methods that are popular in the present day and the arcane mysteries of the world wide web. They bridge this gap with magic.

Now, this magic is a wonderful thing. It enables developers to make applications for the web in a way they’re familiar with and saves them having to think about the ‘web’ part which is:

1. Arcane.
2. Reasonably boilerplate.

However, if you’re trying to ‘learn programming’, starting with web dev is backwards in my opinion. You either choose to use a framework, and then you’re not really learning programming: you’re learning the framework. I always find this unrewarding, as it feels like the framework is doing all of the work and robbing me of the satisfaction. Furthermore, when you’re in the ‘beginner mindset’, you want to know how things work, you want to understand, you want to learn. Web frameworks are powerful when you focus on the ‘what’ and less on the ‘how’. Experienced developers have an understanding of ‘OK, this is what the framework abstracts for me, I’ll let it do its job and I’ll do mine’ and ‘Oh, I am not sure about this and it’s important I learn’. This is obviously a skill only gained by experience.

Furthermore, as you touched on, web frameworks go in-and-out of fashion and can have radically different approaches. With professional experience, you can apply your knowledge of one framework to learning another. As a beginner, I do not believe you have a broad enough understanding to be able to make connections between frameworks. This leads to your feeling of always being on the back-foot.

My recommendation for anyone who wants to learn programming in-and-of-itself, rather than to a specific end, is to start low-level. C was my traditional recommendation, though I may be altering this to Rust. C will never let you forget that you are programming a computer. This might sound ridiculous but it’s remarkably easy to lose track of and once you do, everything (in my head, at least) can get a bit esoteric and conceptual, and I find the ‘grounding’ deepens my sense of satisfaction working with computers.

My diagnosis as it stands is that you attempted to work from ‘abstract’ (web frameworks) to ‘concrete’ (learning how to program) and I’d always advise the reverse. Use C to gain a clear appreciation for how a programming language is altering 1s and 0s on your machine. Then build up with other abstractions, languages, and, in due time, frameworks.

Thinking differently

It sounds to me that, in your experience, you made some correct assumptions and some very incorrect assumptions. Correctly, you identified that structure, ease-of-understanding, and writing your code in a style that you’re comfortable with is optimal. Incorrectly, you assume:

1. Differences in programming styles are more often objectively better, than subjectively better.
2. There exists no good programming style that will ever match how you conceive of code.

Now, these aren’t merely incorrect assumptions, they’re incredibly incorrect. In the professional sphere, those who write code that is well-structured, easy-to-reason about, and is well documented are sparse but they are often highly valued (in good teams, at least). I was always taught, and still vehemently believe, that clarity and readability are absolutely the first priority. Speed of execution is a secondary concern. Terseness is not even a concern of mine at all.

Good code is easily understood by computers, as well as human beings. You are the first human being who has to understand your code. You should always write it in the way that is most easy for you to understand. It is a darn sight easier to optimise neat code, than it is to neaten optimised code.

I believe you’ve come to these conclusions because of your experience learning web development. I find web frameworks and JavaScript as a language to have syntax that is odd and inflexible. The pseudo-code you provided was in JavaScript and is reminiscent of many of the traits that mean that even experienced developers such as myself find it difficult to parse. There’s a reason callback hell is a meme. If you get the opportunity to use some other languages, I believe you’ll see there’s more flexibility in expressing yourself than maybe you’ve had the opportunity thus far.

Furthermore, I am reticent to comment on what is valued in the JS community, as I have never written anything of note with the language but looking at the two code snippets you provided, the first snippet smacks more of a ‘professional’ developer. It’s more modular, finely-grained, expressive.

Finally, if you’re still clinging onto the notion that coding demands a ‘particular’ way of thinking, I encourage you to look-up internet rants from people who know a lot about Java, Python, C++ etc. bashing Haskell. Haskell is a beautiful language that forces its developers to write in a style known as ‘functional programming’. I won’t go into depth about the differences and why functional programming is amazing but let’s put it this way:

How far do you believe you could get in JavaScript without:

• Being able to loop?
• Being able to re-assign variables?

In Haskell, you cannot do either of these things and it’s for the better.

Conclusions

I’m glad to hear you’re happy in your work but disappointed that you were unable to find a groove with programming. From what I’ve read, you absolutely seem to be the kind of thoughtful individual who should enjoy it.

I’d encourage you to start learning Rust. I am learning Rust at the moment myself. Pay close attention to references and memory management. When your material discusses memory concepts, such as the heap and the stack, ensure you develop an intuitive understanding of how they work. Don’t just view this as an important part of your development (one many developers neglect!) but as a window into what is happening on your machine. If your brain is anything like mine (and I think it might be), it’ll further your satisfaction.

Avoid Python. Python is tremendous is you want to use a tool that mandates Python. It will hinder your learning and force you into bad habits if you learn it early. Furthermore, when your project gets to any level of complexity, it’s going to be far more pain than its worth. I understand why Python is so popular in some non-programming domains but it has no appeal to me as anything more than a scripting language with boundless 3rd party libraries.

Look at functional programming, if you’re curious. This free book on Haskell is popular for a reason. Functional programming ideas are slowly making their way into all mainstream languages, for a very good reason. They force you to think differently, and it might be different in a way you prefer.

Thank you so much. This is a terrific insight. A little later I’m going to sit down at my PC and type something up I think will help.

I’d ask you as a fellow ADHDer ✊ if I forget to please remind me to write up my response 😂

EDIT: Response now posted here

Here is a thing I found helpful in my >10 years of programming career: break your problem from top to down (aka Top-Down programming).

Consider this problem: I want to send a post card to my friend.

Now let’s break down this problem into several steps:

1. Obtain a post card
2. Drop the post card at a post office

Next, each of those problems can be broken down even further.

Obtain a post card:

1. Visit a store that sells a post card
2. Select a post card to suit your taste
3. Go to the cashier and pay

Now each of those steps can again be further broken down into even more sub steps:

Visit a store that sells a post card:

1. Identify a nearby store that sells post cards by googling them and find their address
2. Open Google Maps to plan a route to the store
3. Get out of the house and enter your car
4. Drive to the store

You see where I’m going? Break your problem down into actionable pieces you can solve in the programming language of your choosing. How deep you go depends on what programming language to use. If you’re using a High Level programming language such as Python, you usually don’t need to break down the problem too deep in order to solve it. But if you’re using a Low Level programming language (e.g. assembly), you’re going to need to break down your problem very deep into actionable pieces that can be solved in assembly.

Hope that can help you.

I get that, there’s a bunch of unethical associations with everything we use. But right now the main developer of Lemmy has his profile setup with Chairman Mao as his background, his Github repo avatar is Che Guevera, and he has an entire repo filled with propaganda copy-pasta. In the past people have also pointed out that lemmy.ml and lemmygrad.ml resolve to the same IP address although this is no longer the case. Lemmygrad supports the DPRK and transitively one of the most horrific dictatorships in the world, and yet it’s advertised on the “Join-Lemmy” website.

Even if the software itself is apolitical and we can see through the open-source nature of it that it is not going to be abused to further those agendas, there’s no doubt that as that knowledge becomes more commonly known that it could severely impact the whole idea of a Federated Reddit alternative.

I guess the most important thing to consider is that the software, being open-sourced, can easily be forked if this ever becomes a problem.

That’s an important question to ask. For me (and I want to make very clear that this is exclusively how I handle things for myself) there is a huge difference between things I use (or what I call passive association) and things I work on or contribute to (or what I call active association).

While im ok-ish with using their software if they don’t really profit from my usage, I wont be actively helping them. Given the state of the world and western society, I can’t really escape using products that are unethical and as a software developer working for a company I can’t really decide who gets to use my paid work and since I very much like having a bed and a roof and food and even some comfort in that, I’d rather stick to my job, but I can make a choice on who I support with my free time.