• J Lou@mastodon.socialOP
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    11 months ago

    Georgism can be combined with other policies such as democratizing the workplace. Sure, not every Georgist is a leftist. The point is every leftist should be a Georgist. I personally know Georgists that are anti-capitalist.

    The labor theory of property, a negative application of which is the justification of Georgism, also provides a strong argument for workers’ self-management and critique of capitalist property relations

    • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
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      11 months ago

      Georgism offers no criticism against housing commodification, nor even against the home of one household being controlled by another who lives elsewhere.

      It also offers no criticism against business owners controlling enterprise though the wage system.

      If the assets developed on land were controlled by the public, then Georgism would satisfy no demand still unresolved.

      If land simply were rented by the public, yet under private control, then the assets on it would remain privately controlled, and the public would never achieve control over housing or enterprise.

      • PizzaMan@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        Not every policy is implemented to solve every problem. So listing all the things georgism doesn’t solve is a moot point.

        No matter what, the state needs a source of income. And georgism is to my knowledge the least bad of all options, all of which are bad.

        The rules on who can own what land for what purpose, private or personal is independent of the rules on how tax is collected.

      • J Lou@mastodon.socialOP
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        11 months ago

        Georgism is about 1 policy that can be combined with other policies.

        A level of private control by workers’ collectives is actually a prerequisite of having workers’ self-management. If the public decides every aspect of property’s management that would violate the inalienable right to workplace democracy.

        Some strands of anti-capitalist thought overemphasize centralized democratic control rather than decentralization.

        In terms of housing, Georgist land rent should fund a UBI

        • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          Regardless of how you are understanding “workplace democracy”, no conflict occurs between the public controlling land usage and the public controlling enterprise.

          Georgism simply advocates that lands would be rented from the public by private entities, some of which may be private enterprise or rented housing. The general understanding is that private profits would be partially recovered by the public to compensate for private use of land. It expresses no support for the abolition of profit.

          If the public controlled enterprise and housing, then it would of course control land usage. There is no particularly clear case for any problem in leftist tendencies being solved by Georgism.

          • J Lou@mastodon.socialOP
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            11 months ago

            The democratic principle is that the people that are governed in or by an organization should have ultimate positive control rights over that organization. In an enterprise, management governs the people that actually work in the enterprise. Management does not govern the people outside the enterprise. Workplace democracy thus means that the people that work in the enterprise should hold all the positive control rights over the enterprise

            • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
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              11 months ago

              You seem to be using the term “workplace democracy” to erase any control that he public might assert of the overall management of land.

              Yet, the land itself demands to be controlled by no particular faction among the public, but rather by the public as a whole.

              The interest of everyone is not only in controlling the enterprise in which oneself is a participant, but also the broader practices over how land is managed and enterprise is interrelated.

              If an enterprise seeks use of lands and buildings, then the public has an interest in regulating the particular access to them by the enterprise.

              • J Lou@mastodon.socialOP
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                11 months ago

                Public regulation is compatible with Georgism. Sure, in that sense, the public can and should have some negative control rights on the overall management of land.

                The public’s control cannot extend to complete control without hollowing out the notion of workplace democracy. Workers’ collectives have to have some partial rights to control land relevant to their operations as well for there to be workers’ self-management

                • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  Land allocation must to be managed.

                  It is not agreeable for any group to use any plot of land for any purpose that is beneficial to members of the group. Further, it would not be beneficial to a group generally to use land outside of some system of more general planning, for proximity to other buildings, resources, and infrastructure Agreements must be negotiated through some general process of land management.

                  As I earlier explained, Georgism tends not to provide any further value, or solve to any unresolved problem, for leftist tendencies.

                  • J Lou@mastodon.socialOP
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                    11 months ago

                    Why is it not agreeable for any group to use land for purposes that is beneficial to the members of the group? I don’t see how you could have workplace democracy without this. Of course, the workers in an enterprise are going to use their democratic control rights to make decisions that benefit them.

                    Sure, there has to be some sort of urban planning and regulations on land use. That is perfectly compatible with Georgism

        • unfreeradical@lemmy.world
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          11 months ago

          Georgism tends not to augment leftist theory or objectives, if it even offers compatibility.

          Georgians want landlords and business owners to be taxed such that their profits from control over land is offset by the ideal that land is natural and should benefit everyone equally.

          Leftists want to abolish profit, and to restore control of housing and enterprise directly to the public, to be managed cooperatively.