Nancy Pelosi fretted during a meeting with Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez that "Abolish ICE" had been "injected into American political discourse by the Russians," the book says.
alrighty. I’ve watched the democrats sit on their thumbs and do fuck-all for over 40 years. that is the definition of conservative if you remove the fascist parts, which are wholly republican.
they trimmed a conservative love letter to insurance companies by mitt called ‘obamacare’ and called it a huge win while spending trillions policing the world and telling americans what they can do to their bodies.
current democrats are yesterdays republicans. and pelosi? what a conservative cunt.
Democrats should be viewed as an enemy of progressives … because they ARE. They constantly hamstring progress and constantly capitulate to Republicans. They are nothing but an excuse for normies to ignore the rise of fascism. The fact they sometimes slow Republicans down is nothing but the coincidence of having someone who doesn’t vote ENTIRELY in lockstep with the Republicans.
Progressives like AOC being in the Democrat party is nothing but a consequence of our shitty two-party system. I’m positive neither of those fucking ghoul parties would be in power if we had a proper voting system.
Democrats should be viewed as an enemy of progressives … because they ARE. They constantly hamstring progress and constantly capitulate to Republicans. They are nothing but an excuse for normies to ignore the rise of fascism.
No, not democracy itself. That takes many, many forms, and ours (the US, anyways) is an extremely skewed representative democracy where the people themselves don’t even pick two entire branches of government.
When 2/3rds of the government isn’t exactly democratic, I think it’s unfair to use it as the paragon of democratic ideals.
Especially when our two-party system guarantees the options won’t be very representative, either.
I think you need some education. Review this woman’s career and ask yourself honestly how conservative she seems. If what you read on the following page sounds like a conservative to you, I think your definitions are skewed as fuck.
I am shocked that the hardcore leftist also has no qualms about using misogynistic slurs.
By the way, that “conservative love letter to insurance companies” has saved well over 20,000 lives. I’d imagine those people who are not dead might disagree about it having been fuck-all nothing, but I suppose you’d have to ask them.
You’re not wrong, and we should always push for more! But we also shouldn’t delude ourselves into thinking that literally nothing has been accomplished either, particularly when you look at what the other side has been blocking. Biden attempted to institute a $15 minimum wage for federal contractors, which was shot down by a conservative court. The student loan forgiveness was absolutely nuked by the SCOTUS. Just a tiny handful of Republican votes in the Senate could have saved the expanded child tax credit, which had directly observable effects on childhood hunger rates (which shot right back up when it expired).
For issues that hit a bit closer to home for me, the Respect for Marriage Act is a huge comfort allowing me to know that, if I ever have to move to a red state for some terrible reason, my marriage rights will still be upheld. In schools, some basic respect for trans rights has been tied to federal school funding. Trans people are allowed to serve in the military again.
None of these are super huge things, but they are real, and they have meaningful effects on real people’s lives. There are trans teens in high schools, right now, that are able to use the bathroom they want because of Biden. Sure, it’s not universal healthcare or a solved housing crisis, but to them, it is still very real progress, and it’s worth fighting for.
The two parties are big tent parties, often hosting people with disparate opinions on the same issues. The Squad is as Democratic as Pelosi…even though the latter uncritically supports Israeli genocide.
Similarly, the House Freedom Caucus is as Republican as Mitt Romney, even though the latter want to invade Mexico “to stop drug cartels”.
That’s kinda the whole problem with the Republican and Democrat parties: they take a bunch of nuanced political views and then basically turn it into a yes/no poll. I intend to vote for Joe Biden again, but I’m more AOC than Pelosi. I’m 100% certain that there’s a conservative out there that will vote for Trump again that’s more Mitt Romney than Jim Jordan. And I don’t really think that’s a flaw of people, but of the political system itself.
I’m as pragmatic as they get and always trying to understand why people vote the way they do. But if you’re a “moderate republican” and think Trump is still better than Biden/Pelosi, you’re out of touch with reality, brainwashed, or not as moderate as you think.
Thank you, this is exactly what @originalucifer is exhibiting. They ignore all of what Pelosi has fought for over the years, simply because she’s not as far left as they are. And then they categorize anyone not as far left as them as a conservative/Republican. It’s an us-vs-them purity test, designed to sow division, not guild a coalition against actual conservatives/Republicans.
Did you just conflate fucking liberals and communists? Motherfucker there are so many ideologies between those two itd be like conflating Mycanean greece with the fucking Iroquois confederation.
I mean, yeah, when one party wants to put Jesus in the government, make being gay illegal, and deport nonwhite people, I’m not interested in being friends with anyone who supports that mission statement. I’m intolerant of intolerance.
Sounds to me like you’ve created a non-existent boogyman to hate. I’m a conservative who is atheist, gay friendly, and thinks we should have open borders. Yet here we are with you villainizing me because I have different opinions than you on how we should handle national problems. Good job tolerant left, you’re always so tolerant…
They’re literally making it illegal for men to even wear women’s clothing in performances… or trying to. It’s literally in several states’ wording for their recent bout of anti-trans legislation. They’re trying.
If you don’t think they’re overstepping, you’re either not paying attention, or a fucking despicable judgemental piece of shit like them. If you care about people what so ever and vote Republican these days, you’re AT BEST a flaming ignorant hypocrite, “conservative” or not.
I’m a conservative who is atheist, gay friendly, and thinks we should have open borders.
Oh, so which conservative views do you hold that are so important that you’ll vote for candidates that use religion as an excuse to oppose gay rights and oppose asylum as a concept?
I believe in personal freedom. I believe in smaller, more local governance. I believe in gun rights and the right to defend oneself. I believe in free market capitalism, fewer entitlements, and lower taxes. I believe the family structure is key to a thriving society and think it should be encouraged from a policy/tax standpoint rather than dismantled in favor of government “parentage”. I believe in meritocracy rather than the ever shifting goal post of equity. I do support abortion, but not in the late term/full term like many leftists do. I think it is a necessary evil and should never be celebrated.
You clearly missed the part where I said I was for open borders. Which current candidates oppose gay rights, and what rights are we talking about?
The party you support celebrates when 11 year olds are forced by the state to carry rapists’ offspring to term. The party you support cheered when a speaker at CPAC suggested eradicating trans people. Your party does not support personal freedom.
I believe in smaller, more local governance.
Your party won’t let cities ban fracking or plastic bags. But do they ever use “local governance” to codify bigotry into law, like with “don’t say gay” and “papers please” laws.
I believe in gun rights and the right to defend oneself.
And here we come to the first answer that your party actually supports: more school shootings.
I believe in free market capitalism, fewer entitlements, and lower taxes.
restated: Price gouging is just fine, poor people should suffer, and we should give handouts to the rich.
I believe the family structure is key to a thriving society and think it should be encouraged from a policy/tax standpoint rather than dismantled in favor of government “parentage”.
The government isn’t trying to take your kids unless you’re abusing them.
I believe in meritocracy rather than the ever shifting goal post of equity.
Legacy admissions good, diversity bad.
I do support abortion, but not in the late term/full term like many leftists do. I think it is a necessary evil and should never be celebrated.
The party you support does not. Your party rewards rapists by forcing their victims to carry their offspring. And you vote for this.
You clearly missed the part where I said I was for open borders.
I did not. I pointed out that the party you vote for is opposed to asylum as a concept.
Which current candidates oppose gay rights
Candidates? Your current speaker of the house.
and what rights are we talking about?
Equal treatment under the law. Including the right to marry.
Way I see it, you use platitudes about your party that aren’t grounded in reality to support a bigoted party that only does well by the rich, and whose policies harm the vulnerable.
You choose to support that party despite your stated disagreements with them. So some of the things you listed must override your stated support for gay rights, immigrants, and abortion.
ah yes, supporting the party that mostly wants to destroy gay rights and theocracize the state as much as they can, very tolerant of you. i thank you for your courage to enable these politicians to encroach on basic civil rights despite not hating gays, non-christians, and immigrants as much as they do, so you can pretend to get lower taxes and pretend that small businesses are doing better even when almost all republicans cause the complete opposite for people who aren’t billionaires and are more against development that every single other country on earth has implemented into law because it’s so obvious how important it is to humanity like universal health care, paid vacation, and parental leave – which is pretty funny when you consider the US most years spends over half of its budget on healthcare/welfare/social security yet has , comically high prices compared to other countries’ healthcare both private and public, and the health insurance is the worst in the entire god damn first world, plus shit worker protections, meanwhile most of the EU doesn’t have these problems anywhere near as much as the US (it’s insane how leagues ahead they are of the "richest nation on Earth) despite spending way less on these most years.
And people in the US have a much lower median wealth (net worth) than those in western Europe, despite having lower incomes and allegedly “super high taxes” (most don’t, except like Germany), meanwhile the mean net worth in the US is egregiously high in proportion to the median net worth because of the massive wealth inequality. If you make under like 700k then you get taxed more in Texas than you do in most of Europe, for example.
But yea I’m sure the pros of being Republican outweigh the cons voting Republican entails like worse healthcare, awful underfunded and outdated education, terrible infrastructure, high taxes for lower & middle class people, next to zero worker’s rights, letting companies control what you can do with and how you can use the shit you bought (to the point where you don’t own most of the stuff you buy). I mean, how else can you support stripping away the hard-fought victories and liberties of minorities like LGBT and disabled people while acting like you’re not implicit?
I suppose you could say the guns, but Republicans don’t give a shit about your 2nd amendment rights either lol, they vote yes for almost all of the gun laws that conservative voters complain about anyways.
Not to say Democrats are the solution, but obviously they’re generally leagues ahead of Republicans (which is a low bar nowadays to be fair). I mean your prime presidential candidates were Trump and DeSantis, seriously? Even Biden is somehow better than them, and it’s not even close, wtf.
….do you think politics is like picking your favorite sports team? This isn’t about preferences or opinions, this is about choices we make as a society that dictate whether people live or die, whether violence against groups of people (gay, queer, black, Muslim) is normalized or not.
of course a republican and a democrat wouldnt get along. they have completely different ideals.
say it. i dare you.
I’ll dare. This is just like Trump’s RHINO garbage. Not pure enough for you?
alrighty. I’ve watched the democrats sit on their thumbs and do fuck-all for over 40 years. that is the definition of conservative if you remove the fascist parts, which are wholly republican.
they trimmed a conservative love letter to insurance companies by mitt called ‘obamacare’ and called it a huge win while spending trillions policing the world and telling americans what they can do to their bodies.
current democrats are yesterdays republicans. and pelosi? what a conservative cunt.
You have said the actual truth.
Democrats should be viewed as an enemy of progressives … because they ARE. They constantly hamstring progress and constantly capitulate to Republicans. They are nothing but an excuse for normies to ignore the rise of fascism. The fact they sometimes slow Republicans down is nothing but the coincidence of having someone who doesn’t vote ENTIRELY in lockstep with the Republicans.
Progressives like AOC being in the Democrat party is nothing but a consequence of our shitty two-party system. I’m positive neither of those fucking ghoul parties would be in power if we had a proper voting system.
They’re literally white moderates.
The fact you’re being downvoted shows there is a depressing number of moderates in the crowd.
Good job, people. Prove you’re incapable of learning from history.
Isn’t democracy literally set up for the moderates to rule?
No, not democracy itself. That takes many, many forms, and ours (the US, anyways) is an extremely skewed representative democracy where the people themselves don’t even pick two entire branches of government.
When 2/3rds of the government isn’t exactly democratic, I think it’s unfair to use it as the paragon of democratic ideals.
Especially when our two-party system guarantees the options won’t be very representative, either.
Maybe I asked the wrong question so let me try again.
Are you surprised the majority of people are moderates?
Because neoliberals always sell us out to corporations. They’re moderate Republicans fiscally when it comes to helping the public.
I think you need some education. Review this woman’s career and ask yourself honestly how conservative she seems. If what you read on the following page sounds like a conservative to you, I think your definitions are skewed as fuck.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nancy_Pelosi
Claim they need to be educated, then just link fuggen wikipedia??? and hit ‘reply’?? Im actually a little mad.
That’s your whole comment? Where is your actual political education coming from that you would consider that link in any way acceptable.
Ridiculous!
Whine someplace else, troll.
my calling out your pseudo-intellectualism is trolling now huh? I must be getting old.
How many times over those 40 years did Democrats have a supermajority in the Senate, a majority in the House, and the presidency?
I am shocked that the hardcore leftist also has no qualms about using misogynistic slurs.
By the way, that “conservative love letter to insurance companies” has saved well over 20,000 lives. I’d imagine those people who are not dead might disagree about it having been fuck-all nothing, but I suppose you’d have to ask them.
https://www.cbpp.org/research/health/medicaid-expansion-has-saved-at-least-19000-lives-new-research-finds
While the ACA is better than before, I wonder if 20,000 lives is even half what we’d have saved if we had real universal healthcare.
We certainly wouldn’t have increasingly record insurance, hospital, and pharmacy profits (which are all the same vertical orgs anyway).
You’re not wrong, and we should always push for more! But we also shouldn’t delude ourselves into thinking that literally nothing has been accomplished either, particularly when you look at what the other side has been blocking. Biden attempted to institute a $15 minimum wage for federal contractors, which was shot down by a conservative court. The student loan forgiveness was absolutely nuked by the SCOTUS. Just a tiny handful of Republican votes in the Senate could have saved the expanded child tax credit, which had directly observable effects on childhood hunger rates (which shot right back up when it expired).
For issues that hit a bit closer to home for me, the Respect for Marriage Act is a huge comfort allowing me to know that, if I ever have to move to a red state for some terrible reason, my marriage rights will still be upheld. In schools, some basic respect for trans rights has been tied to federal school funding. Trans people are allowed to serve in the military again.
None of these are super huge things, but they are real, and they have meaningful effects on real people’s lives. There are trans teens in high schools, right now, that are able to use the bathroom they want because of Biden. Sure, it’s not universal healthcare or a solved housing crisis, but to them, it is still very real progress, and it’s worth fighting for.
Don’t be a cunt
Tone Police: In Color!
I’d argue it’s fair in both cases.
The two parties are big tent parties, often hosting people with disparate opinions on the same issues. The Squad is as Democratic as Pelosi…even though the latter uncritically supports Israeli genocide.
Similarly, the House Freedom Caucus is as Republican as Mitt Romney, even though the latter want to invade Mexico “to stop drug cartels”.
That’s kinda the whole problem with the Republican and Democrat parties: they take a bunch of nuanced political views and then basically turn it into a yes/no poll. I intend to vote for Joe Biden again, but I’m more AOC than Pelosi. I’m 100% certain that there’s a conservative out there that will vote for Trump again that’s more Mitt Romney than Jim Jordan. And I don’t really think that’s a flaw of people, but of the political system itself.
I’m as pragmatic as they get and always trying to understand why people vote the way they do. But if you’re a “moderate republican” and think Trump is still better than Biden/Pelosi, you’re out of touch with reality, brainwashed, or not as moderate as you think.
It’s definitely a flaw of both.
Thank you, this is exactly what @originalucifer is exhibiting. They ignore all of what Pelosi has fought for over the years, simply because she’s not as far left as they are. And then they categorize anyone not as far left as them as a conservative/Republican. It’s an us-vs-them purity test, designed to sow division, not guild a coalition against actual conservatives/Republicans.
Pelosi was speaking FOR universal healthcare back in the 90s. By the time the ACA was up, she was pushing back against it.
Her words DO NOT match her actions. She is not an honorable person, and anyone who honors her is a brainwashed moron.
She didn’t fight for shit. When her party had majorities, it frittered away concessions and suddenly “couldn’t whip the votes” because “blue dogs”
Please seek help for your neurological disease.
Tell me about the time she defunded the Iraq War
So Trump is a Real Human In Name Only?
An Oompa Loompa disguised as a human.
An Oompa Loompa with Rhonda Sand Tits 4 inch boot lifts.
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I’m wondering about that too. I think the likely answer is that AOC is a liberal (perhaps even a communist) while Pelosi is authoritarian.
Did you just conflate fucking liberals and communists? Motherfucker there are so many ideologies between those two itd be like conflating Mycanean greece with the fucking Iroquois confederation.
Okay, she’s a socialist, not a communist. Happy?
Someone: “I’m looking to start a fight on the internet!”
You: “I’m your huckleberry.”
It seems like a lot of effort to take the bait and play salmon to someone’s trawler, but I’m not here to kink shame.
Love big mouth, that quote and ‘i don’t think you can use that word anymore’ is a daily back n forth between the wifey
Just fyi, I’m your huckleberry is most definitely a quote from Tombstone, big mouth was probably referencing that
Oh goddamnit, and kilmers performance is the best reason to rewatch that movie. How could i fuck that up?
To be fair, you should’ve said Liberal vs Conservative, but yeah.
yeah, i can see that. im a bit bitter after so many decades of inactivity.
What a sad state of affairs that you think two people can’t get along because of political ideals.
I mean, yeah, when one party wants to put Jesus in the government, make being gay illegal, and deport nonwhite people, I’m not interested in being friends with anyone who supports that mission statement. I’m intolerant of intolerance.
Sounds to me like you’ve created a non-existent boogyman to hate. I’m a conservative who is atheist, gay friendly, and thinks we should have open borders. Yet here we are with you villainizing me because I have different opinions than you on how we should handle national problems. Good job tolerant left, you’re always so tolerant…
They’re literally making it illegal for men to even wear women’s clothing in performances… or trying to. It’s literally in several states’ wording for their recent bout of anti-trans legislation. They’re trying.
If you don’t think they’re overstepping, you’re either not paying attention, or a fucking despicable judgemental piece of shit like them. If you care about people what so ever and vote Republican these days, you’re AT BEST a flaming ignorant hypocrite, “conservative” or not.
Oh, so which conservative views do you hold that are so important that you’ll vote for candidates that use religion as an excuse to oppose gay rights and oppose asylum as a concept?
I believe in personal freedom. I believe in smaller, more local governance. I believe in gun rights and the right to defend oneself. I believe in free market capitalism, fewer entitlements, and lower taxes. I believe the family structure is key to a thriving society and think it should be encouraged from a policy/tax standpoint rather than dismantled in favor of government “parentage”. I believe in meritocracy rather than the ever shifting goal post of equity. I do support abortion, but not in the late term/full term like many leftists do. I think it is a necessary evil and should never be celebrated.
You clearly missed the part where I said I was for open borders. Which current candidates oppose gay rights, and what rights are we talking about?
The party you support celebrates when 11 year olds are forced by the state to carry rapists’ offspring to term. The party you support cheered when a speaker at CPAC suggested eradicating trans people. Your party does not support personal freedom.
Your party won’t let cities ban fracking or plastic bags. But do they ever use “local governance” to codify bigotry into law, like with “don’t say gay” and “papers please” laws.
And here we come to the first answer that your party actually supports: more school shootings.
restated: Price gouging is just fine, poor people should suffer, and we should give handouts to the rich.
The government isn’t trying to take your kids unless you’re abusing them.
Legacy admissions good, diversity bad.
The party you support does not. Your party rewards rapists by forcing their victims to carry their offspring. And you vote for this.
I did not. I pointed out that the party you vote for is opposed to asylum as a concept.
Candidates? Your current speaker of the house.
Equal treatment under the law. Including the right to marry.
Way I see it, you use platitudes about your party that aren’t grounded in reality to support a bigoted party that only does well by the rich, and whose policies harm the vulnerable.
You choose to support that party despite your stated disagreements with them. So some of the things you listed must override your stated support for gay rights, immigrants, and abortion.
It’s the guns, isn’t it?
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ah yes, supporting the party that mostly wants to destroy gay rights and theocracize the state as much as they can, very tolerant of you. i thank you for your courage to enable these politicians to encroach on basic civil rights despite not hating gays, non-christians, and immigrants as much as they do, so you can pretend to get lower taxes and pretend that small businesses are doing better even when almost all republicans cause the complete opposite for people who aren’t billionaires and are more against development that every single other country on earth has implemented into law because it’s so obvious how important it is to humanity like universal health care, paid vacation, and parental leave – which is pretty funny when you consider the US most years spends over half of its budget on healthcare/welfare/social security yet has
, comically high prices compared to other countries’ healthcare both private and public, and the health insurance is the worst in the entire god damn first world, plus shit worker protections, meanwhile most of the EU doesn’t have these problems anywhere near as much as the US (it’s insane how leagues ahead they are of the "richest nation on Earth) despite spending way less on these most years.
And people in the US have a much lower median wealth (net worth) than those in western Europe, despite having lower incomes and allegedly “super high taxes” (most don’t, except like Germany), meanwhile the mean net worth in the US is egregiously high in proportion to the median net worth because of the massive wealth inequality. If you make under like 700k then you get taxed more in Texas than you do in most of Europe, for example.
But yea I’m sure the pros of being Republican outweigh the cons voting Republican entails like worse healthcare, awful underfunded and outdated education, terrible infrastructure, high taxes for lower & middle class people, next to zero worker’s rights, letting companies control what you can do with and how you can use the shit you bought (to the point where you don’t own most of the stuff you buy). I mean, how else can you support stripping away the hard-fought victories and liberties of minorities like LGBT and disabled people while acting like you’re not implicit?
I suppose you could say the guns, but Republicans don’t give a shit about your 2nd amendment rights either lol, they vote yes for almost all of the gun laws that conservative voters complain about anyways.
Not to say Democrats are the solution, but obviously they’re generally leagues ahead of Republicans (which is a low bar nowadays to be fair). I mean your prime presidential candidates were Trump and DeSantis, seriously? Even Biden is somehow better than them, and it’s not even close, wtf.
….do you think politics is like picking your favorite sports team? This isn’t about preferences or opinions, this is about choices we make as a society that dictate whether people live or die, whether violence against groups of people (gay, queer, black, Muslim) is normalized or not.
Open your eyes you coward.